Guancha: Thank you for taking your time to have the interview with us. I would like to ask you several questions regarding the situation in Afghanistan and its impact. Regarding the rapid changes in the country, some media says that it will affect the economy in Pakistan negatively. A possible influx of refugees and potential terrorist attack could dampen the economy. But in fact, the transfer of power has been very peaceful. What impact do you think the situation would bring to the regional  security and economy.

Mustafa: I think that the most important things are stability, internal security, and friendly relations with the neighboring countries. As long as that is there, I think that a friendly and peaceful transition of power where everyone is alive, where the human lives are given priority, where the people's security is given priority, both inside Afghanistan and outside Afghanistan. I think that should be on the top of the list. After that, secondary is economy and commerce. And so far, the Taliban has welcomed the Belt and Road Initiative and Chinese investment in the region. I think that as long as these ingredients are there, this is no negative effect in the region. As of now, however, we also have to see that the commitments which the Afghan Taliban had made to China, to Pakistan, to neighboring countries, a gap, because we do not want Afghanistan to give refuge to some organizations which are against the neighboring countries. As you know, that in the past there have been some anti- Pakistan elements in Afghanistan.

So as long as such things are not repeated again, we think that we can move forward peacefully in regard to Afghanistan and the region can still continue to move forward.

Guancha: What about Pakistan, specifically? Will the security situation of Afghanistan affect the local situation in Pakistan?

Mustafa: Pakistan has been the model host to refugees in the past. When the soviet invasion took place in the late 80s, early 90s, Pakistan hosted millions of Afghan refugees who were displaced from their homes in Afghanistan. We were the only country that hosted so many refugees from Afghanistan. Whatever happens in Afghanistan will, certainly, at the end of the day, have some effect on Pakistan. It would be wrong to say that Pakistan remains unaffected because we neighbour with them. On our border, a lot of the time, people come and go. Pakistan believes that the government in Afghanistan should be representative of the Afghan people. And the government should have support of the people of Afghanistan. And Pakistan will support no matter which government comes into power as long as the people who understand that happy.

But Pakistan is also very clear on its core interests. We do not want Afghanistan to be used by hostile countries to create instability in the region. We, Pakistan and China have some shared interests in Afghanistan. And that's why there's been close coordination and close cooperation between both the countries. Some examples of the shared interests are the China Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC).

Now, the CEPC is shared interest of China and Pakistan, because if Xinjiang is negatively affected from Afghanistan, that affects Pakistan. Because Xinjiang is also very important for the Belt and Road initiative. Secondly, Pakistan and China have a shared threat of terrorism. China has also experienced terrorism in the past. So has Pakistan. In Afghanistan, we have a shared challenge of terrorism, which we want to work with the Taliban to address to make sure that there is no a such thing in the future. Number three, connectivity. Afghanistan have borders with a lot of central Asian countries, and also eventually with Iran. The route to Europe can also be through Afghanistan. So that for connectivity, for the Wakhan Corridor, which is very important  commercially and strategically. That the dream of connectivity is there, and Afghanistan can be a part of that. So we have some shared interests there. And these shared interests can be achieved. If there is good trilateral cooperation, in Afghanistan. However, we also believe that, the United States has betrayed the people of Afghanistan.

Guancha:Talking about the U.S., it entered Afghanistan 20 years ago and throughout the years, it has not brought peace to either people of Afghanistan or neighboring countries and regions, let alone economic development. Why is that? Isn't the pursuit of regional peace and development the initial aim of the U.S. by entering Afghanistan?

Mustafa: You see, the United States has spent trillions of dollars, trillions of others on the invasion of Afghanistan. If those trillions of dollars had been spend on education, universities, health care, Afghanistan today would be a new country. It would be a very good one. But those billions of dollars was spent on military, on violence, and on imposing regime on the Afghan people. As you know very well, the US invaded Afghanistan to remove the Taliban, to remove and to catch the terrorist leaders in Afghanistan.

But today, the United States has done a deal with the same so-called “terrorists” that it removed before. We see that the U.S. diplomacy has double standards. Sometimes when it suits them, some countries and people can become terrorists. But then when it suits their political interests, then those same terrorists can become a legitimate actor in international politics.

We see through this example that casting the aspersion of terrorist, the label of terrorists, is not based on principle, but it is based on politics. That is the key. You can take another example, madam. Mr.Pompei, the second foreign secretary of the US in the previous government led by trump, removed ETIM from the terrorist blacklist. And even though it is a terrorist organization, because it is anti-China, they were removed from the blacklist. Because it supports us political strategic interests. We see that the U.S. politics in the region is not based on principles, and on merit is based on selective, narrow political interests.

And you can see from a comparison I would like to make, if you allow. When the Soviet-backed government in 1989, under the leadership of President Najibullah,  was there, it took 3 years for it to fall. At that time the Afghan Taliban was called the “mujahadeen” , and they were supported by Pakistan and United States. But at that time that government took 3 years to fall. But this government, it did not even take 3 months to fall.

So there is a comparison. And this time, the reason why it is so fast was because there was no resistance. We can see on the media that as you very right, he said it was peaceful, because there was no resistance. Predominantly, there was some violent incidents, but overall, there was no fight. We see that the institutions which had been promised to be built by the United States were not there. The capacity was not there. The training (was not there). Afghan army had an air force. I did not see any (improvement) of that air force. I hope that we can see and turn a chapter, a turn a new leaf in Afghanistan, a country which is driven by people of Afghanistan, which is owned by the people of Afghanistan, and which is led by the people of Afghanistan. As long as the people of Afghanistan are happy, I think that China and Pakistan have no favorites in Afghanistan. We will cooperate to take forward connectivity, see back, and women cooperation.

Guancha：Recently, we have interviewed a Chinese businessman in Afghanistan. He told us that the situation in Afghanistan is not as tense as described by the outside world. What Afghanistan still needs is a huge number of basic industry facilities, especially electricity and transportation infrastructure. We know, in recent years, some neighboring countries have lend help to Afghanistan for recovery and reconstruction. In your opinion, is Pakistan happy to see regional countries and people taking the lead in peaceful development and economic development of the region or not.

Mustafa: Pakistan is a big proponent of economic development. Pakistan itself is undergoing massive economic development, particularly in the case of the Belt and Road initiative. We are developing special economic zones, roads and power projects. For Pakistan, it is imperative that it has good economic relationship of commerce, trade and market access of neighboring countries, including but not limited to China, Bangladesh, Nepal, Sri Lanka, and Afghanistan, and Iran.

I think that Afghanistan can be a very good partner for trade, and Afghanistan also can be a gate. Pakistan supports any economic development that I understand which one to take. In fact, I see a partner in Afghanistan, because people of Afghanistan, they need jobs, economic growth, business opportunities and employment opportunities . And that can only happen if we try to revive the economy. Pakistan is in a position where it can do this. It can assist the one is done. So I think that's very good. And also, I think what is important is that this new dispensation will not have safe havens of other countries, other countries which were trying to so discord between Afghanistan and Pakistan, countries which have interfered in Pakistan's internal affairs. And, we want peace and stability and a peaceful Afghanistan is a successful Pakistan. A successful Afghanistan is Pakistan's success. Economy is the way forward. Right now is the time for an economic revolution in Pakistan. Because otherwise, we see that a lot of the basic amenities are missing because of the change in government. There is a lot of uncertainty in chaos. We feel that the way forward lies in economy and economic growth.

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